12/8 over 4/4 Time
Hi everyone,
I'm hoping at least one of you can help me with something:
I have an orchestral piece in 12/8 time, however at points I'd like to put some instruments in 4/4 while other still play in 12/8. The barlines should still meet up (one crotchet = one dotted crotchet in this instance). I'm not sure if this is a feature in Musescore, however if it is, I have no idea how to do it.
Could someone please help me?
Thanks in advance!
As you can see in the image I've attached, the horns and the oboe/EH play in 4/4, while the trumpets, bassoons, clarinets and flutes play in 12/8. I'm really hoping theres a way to do this!
The_Jedi_Steps_and_Finale.mscz
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Comments
See: https://musescore.org/en/handbook/time-signature#local-time-signatures ?
If that's what you mean...
In reply to See: by Shoichi
yes, but i want the 4/4 to function as 4/4 and the 12/8 as 12/8. in that example, 18/16 is equal to 3/4, i undertasnd that part, but i need one crotchet in one instrument to equal a dotted in another. thanks for your fast reply btw.
In reply to yes, but i want the 4/4 to by Oscar JW Music
You describe the way Shoichi said.
Have you never tried and just guessed it?
In reply to You describe the way Shoichi by Ziya Mete Demircan
yes i have tried, but i'll try again. thanks.
In reply to yes i have tried, but i'll by Oscar JW Music
i just tried it again and it works! i must have done something wrong or maybe i'm just stupid. thank you both for your help.
In reply to See: by Shoichi
problem 2: i can put the local time signature in, but when i start putting in the notes, it creates extra beats/rests. they don't go away and when i try to copy/paste things, it tells me something about triplets.
In reply to problem 2: i can put the by Oscar JW Music
attach here your score (or part of it) use the "File attachments" option at the bottom of the page, just above the Save and Preview buttons when you're typing your post. Click on 'File attachments' it will become browse
see: https://musescore.org/en/handbook/measure-operations#duration
In reply to attach here your score (or by Shoichi
just uploaded the file. when i open it myself i get the corrupted file notification. theres no reason why this shouldn't be working.
In reply to just uploaded the file. when by Oscar JW Music
Bar 5 Stave 27 incomplete. Expected: 12/8; Found: 120/64
see: https://musescore.org/en/node/54721
Rewrite the measure. I attach with different page format.
edit______
updates, if possible, to 2.0.3.1 Https://musescore.org/en/download
In reply to Bar 5 Stave 27 incomplete. by Shoichi
i'm still having trouble. i'm trying to put the rhythm of: dotted quaver, semiqauver, minim, crotchet in the horns (4/4 time) at bar 16 and it keeps adding an extra quaver rest.
In reply to i'm still having trouble. i'm by Oscar JW Music
instead of that,now it's coming up with "cannot change local TS: measure is not empty". i'm getting really annoyed now. thank you for your help though.
BTW: We can't see your attached image, because of "Not Found"...
In reply to BTW: We can't see your by Ziya Mete Demircan
i have just put the image up. sorry it didn't work properly
In reply to i have just put the image up. by Oscar JW Music
Ctrl+drag (see attachment)?
_edit_____
excuse the overlap, buona musica!
In reply to Ctrl+drag (see by Shoichi
@Oscar JW Music, unwanted rests, eg. Bar 13 (Cel.) see: https://musescore.org/en/handbook/cross-staff-notation
enter notes on the upper staff and uses Ctrl+Shift+Down arrow
In reply to @Oscar JW Music, unwanted by Shoichi
i know that. i need to make this work. i want the rhythms explained earlier to be in the horns at bar 16 and it's not f*****g working. all i'm getting are error messages and/or extra rests i don't need that f**k up the whole bar and the one after it. i know what i habe to do and i understand it, but musescore won't let me do anything!!!
Anyone who has used local time signatures knows that local time signatures are quite buggy. I avoid using them and attempt to use other methods instead.
If I resort to using a local time signature I do somethings to avoid all the problems you have,
Enter everything that does not use a local time signature first. Just leave the local stuff empty with the main time signature still in it. One of the problems with local time signature measures is that as soon as you make any change, then all of the following measure become "filled" for lack of a better word with rests. You can not copy from, paste to, or change the time signature of any of these measures.
When I do decide to start using local time signatures I start with the last occurrence and and work forward to previous local time signatures do not prevent me from working in this section.
You tuplets error is caused by the internal way MuseScore handles local time signatures. It treats them like relational tuplets (such as 12:8 in your case). Muse score has a "rounding" error that makes these types of tuplets seem internally to spill into the next measure, but it is not displayed that way. Once that happens, it becomes impossible to copy a measure with one of these tuplets because MuseScore won't let YOU have a tuplet spanning measures. It's just bad, and I hope it is fixed in 3.0.
I have to leave for a while now. If you would like I can explain how to avoid using local time signatures in your case. It involves making your own triplets and changing the displayed time signature.
In reply to Anyone who has used local by mike320
ok, that makes sense to me. i originally did a thing with triplets and quadruplets, i know wat you mean by all that and i think i may resort to it, but then i found out about the LTS. i really do hope they fix it really bloody soon because it's useful and sometimes really needed. i usually never have a problem with MS but right now it's giving me the shits. thanks for you your help.
In reply to ok, that makes sense to me. i by Oscar JW Music
I have created a very short score to demonstrate how to do this in case there is something you are not familiar with. I have included notes, but I will add a few more comments here.
When I make my duplets, I make one, then select the entire duplet and press R until I have as many as I want. Alternatively you could fill the measure with dotted 1/4 rests, select the measure and press ctrl-2 to change them all to duplets. You can then select the entire measure and press R to copy it to the next measure as many times as you need to.
In the event you need to span two duplets (like a 1/2 note), you will need to delete the duplet, enter a dotted 1/2 rest and press ctrl-2 to allow for the half note. You can do something similar for other durations, such as select an entire measure and press ctrl-2 for a whole note. If you are only going to copy whole measures, you can actually just select a section of measure rests and press ctrl-2 to give you 4 1/4 rests in each measure. The only problem with this is that you cannot copy out of or paste into and tuplet, so if you want to copy 3 beats, you will have to redo the measures.
Feel free to ask any further questions.
In reply to ok, that makes sense to me. i by Oscar JW Music
Unfortunately the code involving local time signatures is pretty complicated. For the foreseeable future, we will have to just live with the limitations. If you avoid copy and paste and complex tuplets it should generally work OK. I realize that is small comfort, but it's a big multi-facted problem, and so few people use this feature that it didn't get nearly enough testing during 2.0 development even though it was actually one of the first new features added maybe 5 years ago (?). So now the bugs are buried pretty deep.
In reply to Unfortunately the code by Marc Sabatella
that's unfortunate. i love musescore, i've used it for ages and it's really really great for a cost effective notation program. i understand it's hard to fix, but this would be a great feature to have working 100%. i hope you guys can fix it as soon as possible.