Grace notes needing cross staff

• Jan 25, 2015 - 11:09
Type
Functional
Severity
S4 - Minor
Status
closed
Project
MuseScore

Hi,

I want to copy into a MS score the attached PDF from Cesar Franck op.18 (not something really new...), having interesting grace notes. Everything using MacOS 10.9.5.

MS 1.x: it was impossible to link the first grace note to preceding plain note (solved with MS 2beta2)
MS 2beta2 (see attachment): the cross-staff feature doesn't wok anymore for grace notes (is still OK for plain notes), contrarily to MS 1.x.

Finally on either 1.x or 2bet2 I'm unable to write the "grace rest" at the end of bar 2 and bar 4.

So a bug (cross-staff grace note) and a possible feature request (grace rest).

Attachment Size
Cesar Franck Grace note test.pdf 139.22 KB
Grace_note_test.mscz 11.45 KB

Comments

• Jan 25, 2015 - 14:32

I had the idea at some stage. But obviously only 8 normal 32ths would fit in the last beat, where I need sixteen 32ths, one 16th and one 16th rest. From musical point of view, that's why they are grace notes, by the way.
Thanks anyway.

Reply

• Jan 25, 2015 - 16:21

Still, I think it would make more sense to enter them as normal notes, and change the "Actual" duration of the measure via Measure Properties to accomodate them, After all, "grace rests" really aren't a thing anyhow, and these aren't grce ntoes in the classic sense of ornamenting a particular main note either.

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• Jan 26, 2015 - 21:45

Answer to Chen Lung: maybe yes, maybe no... The grace notes are not incorrectly positioned (although I saw something like that another time when importing MS1.2 or 1.3 grace notes into MS2beta1), the "cross staff" (cmd+shift+arrow) applied to one grace note doesn't work anymore with MS2beta, although working with MS1.x. In the example I sent, consecutive grace notes expand on 3 octaves, which requires the cross staff feature. Inside the code it can be either two consequences of the same bug, or two different issues.

Answer to Marc: I only partly agree, Marc. By chance, or because Cesar Franck was a good composer, following your suggestion I could fix it with two 9/8 and a 11/8 "actual" durations (with no link to a real ternary 9/8 for the first two), without inventing a 65/32 or something like that. However these are typical examples of "grace notes after" (available feature in MS 2.0) ornamenting the chord that is just before: nobody claims they should be played at the exact speed of 32ths. From what I've seen on youtube, even if it is not jazz, you can try on your piano...

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• Jan 26, 2015 - 22:17

Right, but you are free to enter 65/32 as well. And as for playabck, keep in mind the primary purpsoe of MsueScore is notation. You should normally prefer the solution that gives the best reuslt notation-wise, even if playback is not precisely what you might want.

The thing is, really, these are neither normal notes nor "grace notes" - not even "grace notes after". Grace notes have a very special relationship to a "main" note, both interm of how they are laid out and how they are played back. The notes in your examples really something else entirely, something MuseScore does not support directly - non-temporal notes that are *not* dependend on any specific main note (whether before or after). So any way you try to enter them now would be a compromise.

So I'm just observing that for now, until cross-staff grace notes are better supported, you'd probably be better off entering them as normal notes and adjust the measure actual duration, as far as what would actually produce the desired results.

Reply

• Jan 26, 2015 - 22:46

What I meant was, the function is broken in the development builds, regardless of the score used (1.3 or 2.0).

It is a regression from 1.3.

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