Mensural time signatures
Renaissance prolations:
Please how do I enter these in a score? I go to master palette, click on symbols, find Mediaeval / Renaissance prolations but when I try to enter one in a measure, it gets plonked on top of a rest or note. What am I doing wrongly?
Comments
The symbols palette is just that - symbols. MuseScore doesn't understand their meaning; you need to position them yourself. You'll probably it most useful to attach to either the barline or the first note of the measure, then move it, then do something else to force MuseScore to re-draw the score so autoplace can kick in to create room for it, then fine tune from there.
If you need further assistance, please attach your score and describe what you are trying to add and where. Then we can understand and assist better.
If it is just the time signature symbols you are after, you can change the appearance by right clicking on the time signature and select "Time Signature Properties...". In the dialog you can, under the "Appearance" heading, select "Other" and there select what I think are the "mensural time signatures".
In reply to If it is just the time… by AndreasKågedal
Yes, thanks for mentioning that! Although I don’t think this is the full set of what can be found in the Symbols palette.
In reply to Yes, thanks for mentioning… by Marc Sabatella
From the answers given previously in this discussion I understand how to replace a standard modern time signature symbol with one from the "other" offered in the Time Sig's Properties window.
However, those "other" symbols lack some of the most commenly needed ones for "early" music, specifically the broken circle with the opening to the right (the symbol" that evolved into our present-day "common time" symbol that looks like a letter 'c'), and the same with a stroke thru it (the one that became "cut time" or "alla breve"), the "other" selection offers to more rarely used left-facing versions of these symbols, so why not the more common ones?
Those do appear in the "Medieval and Renassance Prolations" submenu of "symbols" in the Master Pallette, but I cannot find any way of bringing those into use as subtitutions for time signatures.
HELP!
In reply to Yes, thanks for mentioning… by Marc Sabatella
From the answers given previously in this discussion I understand how to replace a standard modern time signature symbol with one from the "other" offered in the Time Sig's Properties window.
However, those "other" symbols lack some of the most commenly needed ones for "early" music, specifically the broken circle with the opening to the right (the symbol" that evolved into our present-day "common time" symbol that looks like a letter 'c'), and the same with a stroke thru it (the one that became "cut time" or "alla breve"), the "other" selection offers to more rarely used left-facing versions of these symbols, so why not the more common ones?
Those do appear in the "Medieval and Renassance Prolations" submenu of "symbols" in the Master Pallette, but I cannot find any way of bringing those into use as subtitutions for time signatures.
HELP!
In reply to From the answers given… by kbkb14
First use the modern symbol, then make it invisible - it will still show as grey but won’t print. Now select it and superimpose the correct one from the Med and Ren symbols in the Master Palette, adding it in the usual way : https://handbook.musescore.org/notation/expressive-markings/other-symbo….
In reply to First use the modern symbol,… by Brer Fox
Thank you Brer Fox.
I understand your suggestion.
It works, but it's a bit kloodgy, time-consuming and finicky ot get alignment good. I'd be OK with doing that if a more elegant solution wasn't already so near:
It is already possible to enter one of several mensural time symbols and to have them function as normal score elements, without having to attach them to other score elements or to move them around 'manually'.
For instance, if I assign a given time signature, then R-click (mac Ctrl-click) the meter sign, I am offered a menu that includes "Time Signature Properties...". Selecting that, I am offered a number of options starting with "Appearance" under which, if I select "Other:" I am offered a pull-down with eight mensural time symbols, starting with perfect tempus, major prolation (circle with a dot).
Great.
Unfortunately, this list lacks the two most frequently used symbols: imperfect tempus with minor prolation (broken circle facing right) and the same with a slash through it. (Yet it includes one item that isn't a recognized symbol (next-to-last)! Reversing the broken circle to face left is the same as putting a slash thru it, so there is no reason or need to have a reversed symbol with a slash!)
Is there not some way to add symbols to that pull-down menu?
If not, is there some way to prod the developers to remedy this shortcoming of the existing selections?
It seems absurd that Musescore provides this selection of alternatives, including a symbol that doesn't really exist, yet fails to supply to most-needed ones?
KB
In reply to First use the modern symbol,… by Brer Fox
To illustrate what I'm trying/asking, see the attached excerpted first lines:
In the FIRST SYSTEM, I have done as suggested, making the time signature invisible and adding the appropriate mensural symbols from the Master Palette. Each is 'attached" to the first note or rest in its line. This results in them not being vertically aligned with each other, and Musescore does not let me pull them into alignment without first changing the grid horizontal divisions. Alright, it looks OK, but takes a lot of steps, fidgety work, and if I later change the density of notes on the line, the spacing of these elements will be disrupted.
Inelegant!
SECOND and THIRD SYSTEMS I have replaced the metric symbols with mensural symbols, using the means described in my previous message. Simple and elegant - except that they're the wrong symbols, because the correct ones are not provided.
FRUSTRATING! So near, yet... so far.
KB Morley Fantasies à2 EXAMPLE1.mscz