MuseScore and General MIDI Standard
Hi, gang!!!
First of all. I'm not a programmer, so the internal and cryptic computing world is not inside my poor set of skills.
Second: Because the first point, I don't have any clue about how MuseScore communicates the music board (score) in the screen to its own "synthesizer". But... I know this "communication" is not full compatible with the General MIDI Standard.
And, specifically, I'm talking about the number of instruments we can use inside MuseScore (up to my knowledge, it is unlimited), versus the infamous 16 maximum number of MIDI channels.
Well, I want to know if MuseScore team is doing something to try to change the General MIDI Standard, all over the world, at least in the number of channels point.
It is because, I think MuseScore is working so acceptable the link between the on the screen score and final sound!!! So... I don't think MuseScore has to change something about that point. In other words... Why not to change General MIDI Standard as well???
Just a crazy idea from a mad old musician!!!
Blessings 6 Greetings from Chile!!!
JUAN
Comments
I'm an ordinary user.
According to my own experience:
Currently: This channel limitation applies, when the external midi instrument is used for output (Preferences / IO / MIDI Output)
If you export to a MIDI file, a port-information is used for identification. (each port is a separate MIDI device)
Example: If you use 2 separate drum sets, the first drum set is directed to the first MIDI-port and the next drum set is directed to the second MIDI-port. eg: Drum-Set1 => Port1, Channel 10; Drum- Set2 => Port2, Channel 10, etc.
The same applies for non-percussive instruments: When the number of channels is insufficient (1 Drum+15 instrument MIDI channels exceeded), the MIDI-ports are switched on.
In this case you can have 16 ports (devices) * 16 channels = 256 midi channels.
Of course, the MIDI software (DAW or Sequencer or Player) we use in the extracted MIDI file, must support multiple MIDI devices (the destination of the transmitted ports).
MIDI standards are defined by the MIDI Association (http://www.midi.org).
In reply to I am an ordinary user… by Ziya Mete Demircan
Thank you for your data, Ziya!!!
Where can I learn about the use of MIDI ports??? It is absolutely new to me (remember I'm not a programmer).
BTW: I have to undertand that MuseScore, internally, works with different MIDI ports, to exceed the original 16 MIDI channels??? ???
In reply to Thank you for your data,… by jotape1960
Musescore software can use different ports and channels within itself. And it is currently not possible for the user to change any of these settings. (keep in mind that this may be possible in the future)
And the software can send its own internal messages directly to its own synthesizer. (This information doesn't need to match the standard MIDI port, the standard MIDI channel, or the standard MIDI message. Or it may be very similar to standard MIDI messages, but it can implement its own system. )
About MIDI ports (outside of Musescore) :
There are many different ways (and software) to use it.
I'll explain the simplest setup (for MIDI file editing and playing): Sekaiju MIDI Editor (free) with VirtualMIDISynth (also free).
VirtualMidiSynth has 4 midi ports. It's the user's responsibility to determine which SoundFonts will fit into these ports. (These ports can all show the same SoundFont; see: mps-04.png or even different SoundFonts on each port; see: mps-03.png )
Once this is done, the relevant settings in the Sekaiju are made, see: mps-01.png
and different ports can be selected for each track. see: mps-02.png
Of course: different software offer different uses.
These settings can be found in different places in each software.
I tried to explain the simplest way I knew and used it.
There are more complicated software than that (and even the locations of the settings are not easily found).
There are also systems that use a different routing, such as VST, which don't use MIDI ports. (uses VST instrument/device ports)
In reply to About MIDI ports:… by Ziya Mete Demircan
Thank you so much!!!!!!!
You're a genius!!!
In reply to Thank you for your data,… by jotape1960
Another method of using more than 16 instruments is to simply do program changes as needed to allow two instruments to share a channel.
MuseScore honors the General MIDI Standard which is why, when one opens the MuseScore mixer and scrolls through the available instrument sounds, the instrument families are grouped in the same order - e.g. piano family, chromatic percussion family, organ family, etc.
See:
https://www.midi.org/specifications-old/item/gm-level-1-sound-set
Each instrument family is populated by 8 specific instruments. So, for the 'Brass family' you will see listed: Trumpet, Trombone, Tuba, Muted Trumpet, French Horn, Brass Section, SynthBrass 1, and SynthBrass 2.
Having a defined list of sounds enables a GM midi file to be played on different synthsizers with the result that a piano will sound as piano, a trumpet as trumpet.
The exact timbres of each sound might be different - for example the Yamaha company may sample a Yamaha 9' CFIIS grand piano for use in its portable digital pianos. Roland may sample a Bosendorfer for use in their keyboards.
Similarly, for playback in MuseScore, rigorously defining the program change number such as #1 for 'piano' keeps piano scores consistent regardless of what brand of piano the soundfont sampled.
Using GM precludes the piano sounding as a completely different instrument (e.g. bassoon) - which may occur when using a non-GM (customized) soundfont.
Regards.
In reply to MuseScore honors the General… by Jm6stringer
Hi, Jm6stringer!!!
I know MuseScore follows GM about the patches (instruments).
My doubt was only referred to the number of MIDI channels we can use into MuseScore versus the standard 16 only channels into a MIDI keyboard synthesizer.
MIDI (not GM) specifes only 16 channels but that in no way limits one to only 16 instruments. There are different ways that different programs use to map more than 16 instruments into those 16 channels, and it's been that way for decades. The situation might not be ideal and maybe it could be worth totally revisiting how MIDI works in the future, but I kind of doubt MuseScore would be in any position to make that kind of change happen. Programs or devices using the "new MIDI" would be incompatible with older ones.
In reply to MIDI (not GM) specifes only… by Marc Sabatella
Hi, Marc!!!
Well, We have to wait for this "glorius" MIDI future!!!
But...I think MuseScore (and other music software) team could do some... "pressure" with the MIDI Association. Perhaps they will hear this...
Maybe I'm way off topic, but from my understanding, 16 channels is about the max one can do theoretically for all the voices to be heard...now if I were to do an instrument change, would that be like having 17 channels and exceed the limit or would it still be considered 16 channels if the instrument for a part was changed... how about sound change? How does that work into the total number of channels? thanks
In reply to Maybe I'm way off topic, but… by Adria Sorensen
Hi, Adria!!!
The reason I think that limitations should be "revisited" by General MIDI Association is because today we don't have the past computer limitations.
If you think about a Whole (full) Symphonic Orchestra, you need more than 16 channels:
MIDI Channel.......................................Instrument
1............................................................Piccolo
2............................................................Flutes
3............................................................Oboes
4............................................................English Horn
5............................................................Clarinets
6............................................................Bass Clarinet
7............................................................Bassoons
8............................................................Counter Bassoon
9............................................................French Horns
10..........................................................Percussion (Another MIDi Limitations)
11..........................................................Trumpets
12..........................................................Trombones
13..........................................................Tuba
14..........................................................Xylophone
15..........................................................Tubular Bells
16..........................................................Timpani
You have used the 16 MIDI channels and... You need more for strings and... any other!!!
With the "Port" trick Ziya explained, you have the option to put the extra instrument into another MIDi device (I never did it, but I trust it works).
Well, inside MuseScore we don't have this limitation. But... We are in 2018, and... We still have this MIDI 16 channels limitation???
Just a question