Figured Bass
Thanks for the introduction of new system for figured bass.
I found some issues using it.
- On Mac by pressing # on the keyboard, the symbol does not appear in the figured bass text but jumping to the next note. I'm using Mountain Lion with Spanish keyboard.
- I can not type +4, +6, which is the most widely used, at least in Spain (not usual 4 + or 6 + only in URTEXT editions. I am interested in the pedagogical use for Harmony students .
- The numbers of functions (I, IV, VI, etc.) is also common practice to use 'strikethrough' for secondary dominants. II crossed or 'strikethrough' for V of V (Dominant of the Dominant)
Thanks
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Comments
Thanks for your report.
1) About Mac peculiarities, I cannot say anything unfortunately. I remember posts dealing with the inability of Mac's (or some localized Mac versions) to enter the pound sign; possibly searching for "pound" in the site will yield some result.
If no work-around to this limit of Mac's turns out, a suggestion about an alternative character to use for input of sharps would be useful.
2) The use of '+' before the digit in continuo parts is, to my knowledge, very peculiar, as it is the use of the '+' alone as major third indication (under the bass penultimate note). Of course, I do not claim a basso continuo unversal knowledge, far from it! But all the sources I have consulted and all the scores with basso continuo I have seen place the '+' after the digit (if they use this style of notation).
Do you have more evidences for this practice?
3) Tonal functions (or whatever the name is in English) are a different matter. They are used widely enough, of course -- but with a variety of different conventions -- but they are not figured bass.
Until a proper implementation is provided by someone knowledgeable enough with them, regular staff texts could be used, maybe with a custom text style to speed up formatting.
Thanks,
M.
In reply to Thanks for your report. 1) by Miwarre
Thanks for your reply
2) '+' before is certainly a practice that doesn't appear in the figured bass historical editions. But it's used in many books of Harmony, and modern methods of piano accompaniment. Attached examples of "Music Theory. A Guide" by Claude Eugène de Montalembert Abromont, Ed cfe; and "Piano Improvisation" of Emilio Molina ed. Real Musical.
http://books.google.es/books?id=ZqslJKK9ABIC&printsec=frontcover&hl=es&…
In this "vademecum" of theory can find the modern figured bass convections used in Spain.
http://www.google.es/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&v…
A table with the figured bass used can be found in pages 21 to 23.
Although it can be created with other text styles, does not work well to add alterations before the notes or barred numbers.
Could be an alternative text style 'Harmony figured bass', with that properties?
3) Yes, you're right. The harmonic functions are not part of standard figured bass, but it would be useful to use as bottom text line for academic tasks, exercises of Harmony, Counterpoint and Analysis.
Rather than publishing scores of historical figured bass, I was thinking of applying in academic preparation or articles, books, etc.. on harmony, analysis, etc.
Anyway I find really valuable this new capability in MuseScore. Congrats.
In reply to Thanks for your reply 2) '+' by AlvaroBuitrago
Thank you for the documentation supplied.
Figured Bass: if I understand correctly, the required modifications would be
*) allow '+' also before a digit
*) allow '+' alone in a row
Both are contained enough and can be implemented without much fuss, I believe. It is probably not necessary to add a new style, simply an extension of the current 'rules'. A warning though: it is possible that these 'extended' notations will not export correctly (or not completely) in MusicXML.
Symbols for harmonic functions: I think I understand your point. However, I am reluctant to mix different things into a single object; usually this leads to unexpected results and/or complications somewhere down the path. A possible interim solution could be to add the required glyphs (essentially the struck-through Roman numerals and the superscript '+') to a font and use staff texts with a custom text style.
Pound sign: any new for entering the pound sign in Mac's? If not, any idea about another key, easier to enter, to use as an alternative?
Thanks,
M.
In reply to Proposal by Miwarre
On my MacBook, I hold shift and type 3 to get a pound sign (on the keyboard, it is displayed above the number) if that helps?
In reply to On my MacBook, I hold shift by chen lung
Thanks, but, does not work for me.
In reply to Proposal by Miwarre
Great!
Figured bass. good news. I guess everything related to text objects will be difficult to move to XML conversion.
Symbols for harmonic functions: In MuseScore 1.2 I use three lines of text for figured bass with functions. I do this to avoid alignment problems. But the best solution, in my opinion, is that the text style "Tonal functions" (Roman numerals) were independent of"figured bass". (Sibelius uses "Roman numerals." This style of text could be set further away from the staff to make enough space for the text of figured bass.
http://mus.cr/VP45Tf
Pound sign: Sorry, no progress in this issue. I tried different combinations and alternative shortcuts without positive results.
Thank you for listening
In reply to Thanks for your reply 2) '+' by AlvaroBuitrago
...of the current development implementation. It should be in the nightly within one or two days. As far as one can says from a simple screen shot, is it suitable?
NOT FOUND: 1
I noticed that two points are still open:
1) Vertical alignment: in modern edition of continuo parts, figured bass marks usually are aligned at their top (they 'hang' from the staff); in harmony notation, bottom alignment seems prevalent (marks 'sit' on an imaginary line some spaces below the staff).
2) Continuation lines: occasionally they are carried across several marks. This also occurs (very rarely) in Baroque scores; p. 23 of your Vademecum shows a number of them under "Retardos simples".
I plan to address both points in the next days.
Thanks,
M.
In reply to A screen shot... by Miwarre
1) Vertical alignment: Yes. In Harmony the chord symbol is generally used for music analysis and writing exercises. The text below the staff providing space and clarity both reading and writing.
In figured bass for interpreting the numbers to add express intervals from the bass note. It is more comfortable to read over.
It may be more practical to have two different styles. Perhaps: "Figured bass" "Figured bass analysis"
Thanks.
In reply to 1) Vertical alignment: Yes. by AlvaroBuitrago
Selectable vertical alignment has been pushed to master code. It should be available in nightlies dated February 11 or later.
I decided to use radio buttons ("Top"/"Bottom") in the "General styles... | Figured Bass" dlg box rather than 'styles' as this keeps all parameters exposed and accessible. Parameters are few enough to make their manipulation easy enough. I also made dlg box label a little more descriptive.
I am working on 'extended' continuation lines (to connect the continuation lines of several f.b. marks). Code is done, testing is in progress.
Thanks,
M.
In reply to A screen shot... by Miwarre
This is the current status of F.b., with bottom vertical alignment and extended continuation lines (in the last four measures). I copied a few maesures from your Vademecum (p. 24), forgive possible errors!
NOT FOUND: 1
There is still an issue with delayed redrawing while F.b. elements are added, but I think it is already usable.
Any feeback would be appreciated!
M.
There has been a discussion (in #musescore IRC channel) about adding a new feature for harmonic analysis indications and the decision has been to postpone it to after ver. 2.0.
The importance of the feature is recognized, but releasing ver. 2.0 as soon as possible and as reliable as possible has a higher priority: fixing the many open bugs comes before adding new features at the moment.
In addition, a short and informal survey quickly detected several forms and possibly several dialects of it, which makes defining the new feature not so quick as one could expect.
The issue is NOT closed, only postponed. Gathering more documentation and details (possibly about usages in different countries) goes on!
Thank you,
M.