Tuplets or irregular groups
For those who are unfamiliar with the music theory, I would like to submit the following problem: tuplets or irregular groups of notes can be either "redundant" (i.e. 3 instead of 2, 6 instead of 4) or "lacking" (i.e. 2 instead of 3, 4 instead of 6) and, when printed, they should be correctly notated using a number with a slur if redundant, and a number with a bracket if lacking. I can't understand why Musescore only gives the possibility to notate them with a bracket or just with the number alone... I understand that there is the possibility of a quite tricky workaround consisting in the creation of a slur, then adding the number and then again moving the slur so that it superimposes the number, but this would imply a lot of work that could easily be avoided if in the tuplets palette we could find both the possibilities... I think that a professional music notation program should be aware of this problem. I'm also sending a screenshot of what I' trying to explain.
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Comments
This has been discussed for a very long time, for example (2014...): https://musescore.org/en/node/39961 You'll notice that an initial feature request had been made: #111626: Add option to display tuplet brackets as slurs to match historical notation
Perhaps there's a more recent one on Github?
You'll also notice that the argument of Elaine Gould (Behind Bars, page 194) - image below - must have weighed heavily in this choice, I quote: "The numeral should be encompassed by a square bracket, and not the curved arc of old editions, as this looks like a slur". Relentless!
During the development of Versions 2 and 3, Behind Bars was the "Bible" of MuseScore developers. Perhaps less so now, it seems (?) with other sources also being considered by Simon (@Oktophonie), the current engraving expert. Perhaps we should ask his opinion?
i always associated slurs with older classical music and brass band marches. I have never used the terms "redundant" or "lacking" for tuplets nor been taught that.
Hmm...
So, viewing your example, are you saying that both slurred tuplets and bracketed tuplets can be notated in the same score? And that the particular use of slur or bracket is dictated by whether the tuplet is "redundant" or "lacking"?
In reply to So, viewing your example,… by Jm6stringer
Pretty sure that's what OP is saying.
But my understanding agrees with cadiz1's, underquark's, and apparently Gould's: curved slurs, no. I would argue that the "redundant" or "lacking" question is not worth having any effect on the score. It's going to be obvious from context which it is ... and the player's won't care!
Reading all the comments to my post I'm feeling very old fashioned (and uh... old as well)... sorry, my fault (simply due to my venerable age ;-)!
As you can see from the examples that I'm posting (taken from my old textbooks), this is what we were taught in Italy back in the 1950/60: if there were more notes than expected according to the meter it was called "gruppo sovrabbondante" (which I translated with "redundant") and if the notes were fewer than expected it was called "gruppo mancante" (which I translated with "lacking") and they had to be notated differently: slurred or bracketed, depending on the case. Musescore 4.5 is a fantastic piece of software and it allows me to write everything I fancy ! Of course I will stick to my long and tricky workaround when writing "slurred" tuplets, in spite of what one can learn on "Behind bars".
In reply to Reading all the comments to… by vovokiosse
Thanks for your reply. Having been in the MuseScore forum for years, I realize that music is international in its appeal and that aspects of notation can vary over time and locale.
I have seen both slurred and bracketed tuplets; but never to differentiate "gruppo sovrabbondante" from "gruppo mancante" in the same score. Such a formal, pedagogical distinction never came into play (for me in the USA).
Thanks again for your "spiegazione approfondita".
In reply to Thanks for your reply. I… by Jm6stringer
Thank you for your understanding! As a very long time "Finale" user, It never occurred to me that this could be a problem, given that Finale allows both alternatives, slurred and bracketed tuplets. I'm now migrating to Musescore, which surprises me a lot (!) every second with its brilliant features and I'm sure I will not regret the migration, also considering that this is making me learn new things!!! My regards ;-)