a few questions about instrument names/keys in a 19th c. orchestration I'd like to re-typeset in MuseScore
I'm a classical pianist, and I know next to nothing about orchestration or the history of orchestral instruments. I would like to notate a score published in 1880 for piano and orchestra into MuseScore; it is in the key of A major, and most of the instruments (and their key signature transpositions) are obvious.
However, I am perplexed by a few instruments' names and keys.
In particular, I don't understand exactly what kind of horns Corni are - or how Corni in E and Corni in F could be notated in a key signature with no accidentals.
I also don't understand what sort of trumpet 'Trombe in F' signifies - or, likewise, what accounts for the key signature shown.
Finally, I can't find a translation for the 'E.H.' that follows 'Timpani in A'.
Any insight or answers would be appreciated! Thanks in advance.
Comments
I can answer some of your questions, and give some good guess / place to look for more.
"Corni" is "horns", as in what we might otherwise call "French horns". They are normally in F today, but back in the day, it could be anything - apparently, both F and E horns are called for here. Maybe the better deal with a key change? At one point in history, these would literally be the same horns (and same players) but they'd change a "crook" in the horn to change keys. And for whatever reason, it was traditional to write their parts with no key signature.
Trumpets were also once common in lots of keys, so I guess that's a trumpet in F, and i guess there was probably a similar convention of not including key signatures.
In reply to I can answer some of your by Marc Sabatella
I agree with Marc: the horns ("corni") are scored for 1st and 2nd horns in E and 3rd and 4th in F. Modern players will transpose the horn in E part to F; this is done "on the fly" as the player is reading the part. Some players prefer the part to be transposed to horn in F (a semitone down) and then they would deal with the key signature, typically B major (5 sharps). Horn parts were usually written without a key signature in the days of hand horns (before the development of valves) and E is the dominant degree of A major. Composers did call for horns in A, but that instrument had a rather shrill tone and horns that were crooked in the keys of E flat, E and F were preferred for their more sonorous tone quality.
Trumpets were built in the same keys as horns and here we have a pair of trumpets in F.
The letters E and H refer to two timpani, one tuned to E and the other to B natural. B flat is so common in music that German musicians call B flat "B" and B natural is called "H".
For what concerns the timpani, those are most probably the pitches of the three timpani, i.e. A, E and (natural) B (H in German notation).
In reply to For what concerns the by ABL
Thanks for everyone's help. 'Timpani in A, E, H' was a real *duh* moment for me!
I am concluding that this is a project - though the result would be valuable - in which I would be out of my depth. If I understand correctly, the instruments about which I was confused don't fall into a 'transposing' vs. 'non-transposing' binary, and I have no idea how to enter the pitches for them in a way that would (1) match the hard copy I'm working from, (2) play back correctly, and (3) conform to MuseScore's constraints on instruments, key signatures and transposition.
In reply to Thanks for everyone's help. by [DELETED] 448831
No, it should be totally doable. Select the Horn in F from the list for that. If there were no horn in E or trumpet in F, add a regular one then change the transposition in Staff Properties (there *are* horns in E and trumpets in F under "All Instruments", though). Then delete the key signature for just those instruments by Ctrl+clicking them and pressing "Delete". Hmm, this would then still show a key signature if you switch to "Concert Pitch" mode. So if that bothers you, you can try the new "open/atonal" key signature - ctrl_drag one of those to the relevant staves. then you will have no key signature whether in concert pitch mode or not.
In reply to No, it should be totally by Marc Sabatella
Marc, thanks again for your assistance. I appreciate it!
I got so far as selecting and deleting the individual key signatures for the E and F horns and the F trumpet ... and so far, so good. I probably don't need ever to change to 'concert pitch' mode, so this could work.
However, I couldn't proceed to the next step in your instructions to try the new 'open/atonal' key signature. Basically, I don't know just how to create that 'open/atonal' key signature once I've gotten as far as Shift-F9. Whatever I try - and then drag to my key signature palette - I'm unable to implement because, when I drag it back to 'the relevant staves', it replaces the valid key signatures for *all* the instruments in the score.
What I mean to say is that any key signature for a specific instrument can be deleted by CTRL+click, Delete - but any attempt to implement a new key signature for a specific instrument is having the effect of imposing that new key signature on every instrument.
I'm seem to be definitely not understanding something critical - or, alternatively, failing to complete one or more of the steps correctly.
In reply to Marc, thanks again for your by [DELETED] 448831
You need a build from some time in the last few days - the open/atonal key signature is new. Last item in palette, shows as a greyed-out "X". If you have customized your palette, you would need to reset to factory, I guess, or perhaps use the Master Palette. Or, if it's not there already, you can create it yourself - it's just a custom key signature with nothing in it.
Once you find it, you need to hold *Ctrl* while dragging to get it to only apply to one staff.
In reply to You need a build from some by Marc Sabatella
Got it! It was the CTRL+drag that I was failing to do.
Thank you VERY much. This score is somewhat over 100 pages, so it may never actually reach fruition - but I understand a bit more today than I did yesterday, and that's a good feeling. :-)