Guitar Duet - Two Positions

• Aug 10, 2022 - 23:10

I'm writing a guitar duet in the key of D. To make things sound more interesting I'm tuning each guitar differently - DADGAD and standard - and I would like the DADGAD guitar to be played at the nut and the standard guitar to play out of the C position using a capo at the second fret.

I'm writing the melody using standard notation and have linked tab scores since one of the guitarists can only read tab.

I tried using the capo feature and can't figure it out. I followed the only directions. I inserted staff text on the first note of the score. Then, I went into inspector and selected capo at the 2nd fret. The tab did not appear to show that the guitar was capoed at the 2nd fret.

Please help!!!

Comments

• Aug 11, 2022 - 06:03

You wrote:
I tried using the capo feature and can't figure it out.

This is not specific enough as to what can't be figured out.
As a start, have a look at this: Capo_examples.mscz

The tab did not appear to show that the guitar was capoed at the 2nd fret.

If you placed the staff text on the standard notation staff, then simply copy it to the TAB staff. Hopefully, it says something like "Capo at 2".

Reply

• Aug 11, 2022 - 15:33

The capo example doesn't seem right to me.

My views is that when you put a capo at the 2nd fret:

(A) The positions of the notes on the tab should adjust. For example, looking at the first three notes: (i) the C on the 5th string should show as fret 1, (ii) the D should move from the 4th string to the 3rd fret of the 5th string, and (iii) the E should show up as the 0 (nut/capo) on the 4th string.

(B) playback should still be in the same key as the notes are written.

Reply

• Aug 11, 2022 - 18:50

As I understand it the whole point of using a capo is that it effectively moves the nut, but the tabs do NOT adjust, only the resulting pitch. The linked standard notation doesn't change in appearance - it's still showing a C major scale - but the playback follow the Capo 2 instruction and gives a D major scale.

"GUITAR CAPOS
If a capo is used, a Roman numeral indicates the fret where the capo should be placed. The standard notation AND tablature is written as if the capo were the nut of the guitar. For instance, a tune capoed anywhere up the neck and played using key-of-G chord shapes and fingerings will be written in the key of G. Likewise, open strings held down by the capo are written as open strings." https://acousticguitar.com/acoustic-guitar-notation-guide/

Chord fingerings don't change either - one of the reasons for using a capo is to simplify playing in awkward keys.

Reply

• Aug 11, 2022 - 19:40

That is certainly one way to look at a capo. Just move it up or down, and change the key. Many people who prefer this want the notes in the key that they are playing out of, not the key they are actually playing. You don't need a capo feature for that purpose.

The other approach is to type up a score using notes and then move the capo around to see the easiest position to play. A capo feature in the software would be very helpful if it could accommodate this approach.

As an example of the first approach, many people accompany a mandolin playing in D with a guitar playing capoed to the 2nd position in C. When trading lead and chords, the guitar player would prefer to read the notes in the key of C and there is minimal need for a capo feature.

As an example of what I'm trying to achieve, I'm writing for two guitars that are both playing in the same key. Let's say D for simplicity. The first guitar is playing in one tuning - for instance DADGAD. The second guitar is playing a countermelody in D, but using standard tuning capoed at the 2nd fret (or another fret). Writing is much easier if I can key all the notes for both guitars in D. I can then move the capo around and see the fingerings at different positions.

Reply

• Aug 12, 2022 - 08:10

the capo feature as it is is exactly what nearly every guitar players wants from it.
for what you want: if you move the notes higher in the standard notation you can see that the tablature change. If you see that the tabs look easy 4 frets higher go back to the original and put the capo on fret 4 and you and the guitar player are happy.

Reply

• Aug 12, 2022 - 08:52

wolfgan wrote >> the capo feature as it is is exactly what nearly every guitar players wants from it.

Agreed. Said differently, "MuseScore's capo feature produces the effect nearly every guitar would expect."

wolfgan wrote >> if you move the notes higher in the standard notation you can see that the tablature change.

True, but moving notes higher is not the most direct way for finding capo-friendly options.

In contrast, by moving notes lower (i.e. transposing the part or section downward) you'll readily find alternate keys that are reasonably "rectified/mitigated" by a capo.

For instance, key of Eb is problematic for certain styles of guitar music, but lowering the key and compensating with a capo can yield to a simpler and more "laissez vibrer" guitar style. Here are some examples:

• you can lower the Key of Eb 1 semitone to D and compensate by capoing at fret 1 so the sounding pitch "returns" Eb. In summary: Key goes down 1 semitone, capoing at fret 1 compensates. Think of it as -1 + 1 = 0, where 0 is "the original key."

• you can lower the Key of Eb 3 semitones to C and then compensate by capoing at fret 3 so the sounding pitch is Eb. In summary: The key goes down 3 semitones, so you capo at fret 3 to compensate.

In contrast, you'll first encounter unrewarding or unrealistic capo options when raising the key:

• if you raise the key of Eb to 1 semitone to E, you'd need to set the capo to -1 (which is impossible) ... or set the capo 11—which at best is undesirable. But in theory, think of it as 1 + 11 = 12, or an octave higher than the original Eb arrangement, but Eb nonetheless.

• if you raise the key of Eb 4 semitones to G, you'd need to set the capo to fret 8, which is still higher than I'd want to capo. You can think of it as: 12 (the octave) - 4 (the key change) = 8 (the compensating capo fret.)

• if you raise the key of Eb 6 semitones to A, capo 6 bring the pitch back to Eb. 12 - 6 = 6.

So you'd have to try several keys before finding one that works well in combination with a capo for the key of Eb.

scorster

Reply

• Aug 11, 2022 - 23:06

As a TAB only guitar player with music books from a variety of publishers I have only ever seen TAB fret numbers relative to the capo, so, just as you say, they do not adjust but the pitch changes. Thus a C major chord with capo 2 still looks like a C major chord in TAB but plays as D. I mainly don't even know what note names I am playing, they are just fret positions relative to the nut or capo.

Reply

• Aug 11, 2022 - 20:05

You wrote:
My views is that when you put a capo at the 2nd fret...etc.

With a capo at the 2nd fret simply "pretend" to play at the nut so that playing in the key of C only "sounds" like one is playing in D. Regardless of capo position, fret 3 on the 5th string is written as C - the same distance from the nut or the capo. The capo changes the sounding pitch only. Moving the capo to the 5th fret will make the third fret of the fifth string (still written as C) "sound" as F.

You wrote:
...the C on the 5th string should show as fret 1...

Fret 1 on the 5th string is always Bb - from the nut and also from the capo (fake/pretend nut).

This allows a (novice) player who, for example, memorizes a melody in C major to "plunk" the exact same string/fret positions and play in different keys simply by changing the capo position. No need to "move from the string to the 3rd fret of the 5th string", or that "the E should show up as the 0 (nut/capo) on the 4th string." Simply read/play the score in C major and "pretend" the capo is the guitar nut. The score will "sound" in different keys depending on the capo position.

Reply

• Aug 12, 2022 - 09:24

If you really do want absolute fret numbers then you could:

1) Add a stave text saying "capo 2" but don't actually apply any capo.
2) In the tuning section, drop every string by 2 semitones.

Reply

Do you still have an unanswered question? Please log in first to post your question.