Bassoon soundfont bug?
I don't know if this is a bug so I am posting this in general. Anyway, I am working on the Beethoven 5th symphony and in just a week I am almost done with the woodwind section of the exposition.
I noticed something weird going on with the Bassoon in the second theme not long before the repeat.
The low Bb(Bb in great octave) sounds brassy on the bassoon. Shouldn't it sound more like a bass woodwind than a bass horn?
Now this is only in the second theme as far as I know. But still, why does it sound brassy at that low note? Is it a soundfont bug? Resonance with the Contrabass soundfont maybe?
I am asking because as far as I know, the low register of a bassoon(Or any bass woodwind for that matter) should not sound brassy.
Start at measure 111(3 measures of just eighths on all instruments) and you'll see what I mean by a brassy sounding Bb on a bassoon. It should not be brassy so why is it?
| Attachment | Size |
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| Symphony no. 5.mscz | 22.25 KB |
Comments
I don't know about the default Fluid soundfont, but here is the bassoon soundfont I use:
http://ethanwiner.com/bassoon.zip
It's a little loud, but that's exactly what a bassoon should sound like. Woodwinds, by their very nature, do NOT sound alike at all. There is no 'bass woodwind' sound.
Here's a youtube video, this is what low bassoon should sound like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ICfD7gr2Bdk
Bassoons are quite often written with French Horns because their sounds blend very well - the face melting brass opening of Tchaikovsky's Symphony 4 has bassoons in it's brass choir - so depending on what you mean by brassy, yes, bassoons sound brassy?
In reply to I don't know about the by Laurelin
I mean that it sounds like a horn or other brass instrument. I haven't put any brass instrument notes in there yet(last time I had a lot of trumpet trouble so I decided to try again but this time section by section(strings first, then woodwind, then brass, then percussion, then solo if any and within the section, from high register to low register(so flute before oboe and oboe before bassoon for example))) so that is why I could hear the bassoon as being brassy. But I only hear that brassy sound at the low Bb. Other notes sound more similar to a bass clarinet.
In reply to I mean that it sounds like a by Caters
I've downloaded your score and listened to it using Fluid, the default soundfont. I assume that is what you are using? The bassoon sounds the best - most realistic - of all of those instruments. It's not supposed to sound anything like a bass clarinet - I play bass clarinet, I sit next to bassoons. They sound a bit more alike the lower they go, but your Bb is an octave above that. As I said, they are often scored with French Horns as they blend very well/sound alike.
That's also an octave above the video I posted...
So here, Beethoven's 5th symphony, movement 2, a bassoon solo followed by a horn solo. They are supposed to sound similar.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mXFrjgYRMJI
That's first line G-C-G-E-DC-high G
If it doesn't sound like that, then check what soundfont you're using - or export it as an mp3 so we may all hear what you're hearing, because I'm not convinced I am.
'Brassy' generally means trumpet in full fanfare mode to me, so loud, in your face, brilliant brass sound. Bassoon should sound nothing like that. But it's a good substitute for a mellow horn sound, or paired with horns to make the winds and brass blend together better.
And I gave you the soundfont I use for bassoon up above, you should try that and see if it makes a difference. It's recorded by a pro bassoon player, so it should be completely realistic, if, as I said, a bit too loud.
Edit: Ok, I just spent half an hour trying to export mp3s of different soundfont, and it kept giving me Fluid - and only Fluid - for your score. So here, this is what my bassoon soundfont sounds like on a Bb. It's the starting note for the bassoon.
Does it sound better? Worse? I think it sounds about the same as the default bassoon.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/dfsdzae8s36the8/Bassoon%20testToH.mp3?dl=0
If you like that sound better, you should download Ethan's Bassoon. Musescore doesn't have any control over the soundfont - That's built by fluid. But if you don't like the default provided by Fluid, there are plenty of free ones on the internet. http://midkar.com/soundfonts/ is particularly good, and can entirely replace Fluid. It also has a good bassoon.
In reply to I've downloaded your score by Laurelin
MuseScore does have control over the soundfont. FluidR3Mono is derived from some other version but heavily customized meanwhile
In reply to I've downloaded your score by Laurelin
Your Youtube link is to the section of Movement 4 featuring the piccolo - not the 2nd Movt section you said.
I think this is the section you mean.....
https://youtu.be/EQIVWhKhwPA?t=50s
Neither the original FluidR3 nor FluidR3Mono are produced by Fluid!
The original was produced by Frank Werner and released with an MIT licence in 2008
MuseScore's default soundfont - FluidR3Mono - was produced from Frank Werner's original soundfont by Michael Cowgill in 2014, and has had many subsequent improvents, fixes and additions since. I have attached the changelog for your interest.
Incidentally Ethan Winer has kindly allowed us to incorporate his Temple Blocks instrument in FluidR3Mono.
Version 2.310 is currently unreleased - I will be doing that tomorrow.
In reply to Your Youtube link is to the by ChurchOrganist
Ethan let Musescore have one of his sounds? That's awesome. I use both his bassoon and his cello - I have yet to find anything I like better. You are correct that I had a typo there.
And because I have the excuse(and it's awesome), have an absolutely face melting brass opening from the famous Bud Herseth - CSO, Tchaikovsky's 4th symphony.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-c1LLZaVCA
It's all brass... and bassoon. And then bassoon plays with clarinet, two of the best instruments for blending with horn, which warms up the theme and provides a really nice transition to strings.
Although RImsky Korsakov says that clarinet with oboe provides the closest approximation to a trumpet sound outside a trumpet. I'm trying it someday, I swear.
In reply to Ethan let Musescore have one by Laurelin
Rimsky-Korsakov is definitely a smart man. He even has a fan club, see: https://musescore.com/groups/nark-fan_club
In reply to I've downloaded your score by Laurelin
Re: "just spent half an hour trying to export mp3s of different soundfont, and it kept giving me Fluid":
Try the "Save to Score" button in the Synthesizer.