Stop redirecting users to musescore.com
"Free" trials which cost 60 dollars, nonsensical, disingenuous and predatory "sales", and ostensibly hostile UI design are poor form for any application. I am well aware (now) of the distinction between the .com and .org domains. But as a returning user, the design of the .org site's search bar undeniably exists to conflate the two. That three letters at the end of a common trademarked name are distinct does not exculpate the open source organization from complicity in the poor behavior of its commercial stablemate.
It is an insult to your users to transparently redirect us to what is effectively a scam site, embed integration of said scam site into your software, and then for prominent members of the community to feign ignorance as to the intent and ramifications of doing so. The "search for sheet music" form makes absolutely no distinction between the FOSS and commercial organizations, gives no notice upon redirection to the external commercial site , and blatantly mimics the layout, name, and design language of the site hosted on the .org domain. This is a dark pattern and user hostile. If you do not wish to support .com users do not deceive .org users into using the .com site. Simple.
I've dispensed with my typical candor at my utter dismay that I very nearly had 60 dollars conned out of me by a an open source project. For this I do not apologize.
Stop redirecting users to musescore.com
Comments
> Stop redirecting users to musescore.com
But this is their only chance to get a refund 😕
The only posibility to use the musescore.com website is this:
![ScreenShot 363 Stop redirecting users to musescore.com _ MuseScore – Mozilla Firefox.png]( "ScreenShot 363 Stop redirecting users to musescore.com _ MuseScore – Mozilla Firefox.png")
If you enter here a search string you will be redirected to musescore.com.
Otherwise, we are voluntary users, just like you, who have no influence on the design of the musescore.org website ...
In reply to The only posibility to use… by HildeK
As evident in my post I am now aware of this.
1) please indicate for me where it is clarified that the "search for sheet music" form directs users away from the musescore.org domain before they do so.
2) please indicate what benefit concealing this redirection confers upon the user.
I cannot remark upon any agreements musescore.org may or may not have with musescore.com. But concealing a UI element as if it were native to a website which in actual fact redirects to an external commercial entity is a classic dark pattern of UI design. See:
https://www.deceptive.design/types/disguised-ads#:~:text=Definition,may….
While this site states the classic reason to employ this pattern is for commercial gain, there's no evidence to assert this as being the case here. That does not change that musescore.org conceals the fact that it links to a website public opinion of which
seems to overwhelmingly be that it is a scam. An open source project developed for the benefit of its community should not be promoting a scam to the same community.
In reply to As evident in my post I am… by Jeremiah Griffin
We agree. The website is deceptive. But no one here has any control over it.
We are all just users of the software. Some of us also use the musescore.com website, but none of us have any control THERE either.
The only reason people re-direct others to musescore.com is when they ask questions that can be resolved only by musescore.com. If we did not re-direct them in that fashion, we would be doing them a disservice, not providing the advice that is the only way for them to get the help they need.
Let me put it this way: Imagine a criminal organization controls (let's say) trash pickup in a city. (Which certainly isn't the case in any American city named "New York" that I'm aware of.) Your neighbor is having a problem with his trash pickup. Are you going to direct him to contact that criminal organization and maybe get his problem resolved? Or are you not going to do so, and thus give him no possibility to get his problem resolved?
See How and where to ask for support
Don't complain to a Yamaha motorcycle dealer about a Yamaha guitar
In reply to See How and where to ask for… by Jojo-Schmitz
Read my post again. I did not once ask for support of or changes of the musescore.com product or page, but of the musescore.org website.
Please indicate for me on the linked page where it is stated that the improper place to request or discuss changes of the musescore.org website is musescore.org
If we're employing analogies yours is inaccurate. The search function is more akin to me visiting a Yamaha motorcycle dealer, being blindfolded and thrown in the back of a van, and upon my compelled arrival at the guitar dealership, offered a complimentary guitar with a motorcycle drown on its top for one hundred thousand dollars.
I'm not asking for the behavior of the musescore.com people to be improved. I am asking, as stated twice in my post, for the musescore.org people not to deceptively embed an advertisement of a commercial entity widely panned online as a scam on musescore.org
In reply to Read my post again. I did… by Jeremiah Griffin
Free trials and payments don't exist here on musescore.org, only over on musescore.com
In reply to Free trials don't exist here… by Jojo-Schmitz
Read what I am writing. You are writing at cross purposes with me. For the third time I do not care to change anything about the musescore.com free trial. I am asking the musescore.org website not the deceptively link users to musescore.com.
If not here, please provide an alternate location where I may suggest changes to the musescore.org website. I do not see anything in the musescore GitHub organization where contributions to the website may be made which is the reason I am posting here. Git/hub is not my primary source control tool so I could well be missing something.
In reply to Read what I am writing. You… by Jeremiah Griffin
Musescore.org having links to musescore.com and vice versa is not wrong, there are the scores and the commercial offerings, here's the support for the free MuseScore Studio.
Nothing deceptive about that.
In reply to See How and where to ask for… by Jojo-Schmitz
The search desk of Yamaha motorcycle doesn't redirect you to Yamaha guitar
In reply to The search desk of Yamaha… by frfancha
That's their problem ;-)
Well said!
So let's read what the search box says. "What kind of tacos do you like?" Wait. There are no tacos on musescore.org.
Or does it say "Search for Star Fish"? Hmmm, I don't think there are any Star fish on .org.
Wait. I cleaned my glasses and I now see that it says "Search for Sheet Music". But there isn't any sheet music on .org. If I type the name of a song, where O where will I be directed? Maybe, just maybe I'll end up somewhere that has the sheet music I am looking for. If I didn't mean to go to .com, I just hit the back button. Or if I'm not looking for sheet music why did I use the search box?
In reply to So let's read what the… by bobjp
The problem is not that the .org domain does or does not host sheet music. The problem is that the .com domain overtly engages in UI design practices widely held industry professionals to be deceptive. The problem is further that the website hosted at the .org domain redirects to the deceptive .com domain without prior notice or clear indication to new users. The problem is that the musecore application deeply integrates with this deceptive .com domain throughout.
Nowhere did I state I was not expecting to find sheet music upon searching for sheet music. Nowhere did I request the .org domain host sheet music. Nowhere did I state anything about star fish. Your remarks are sarcastic and orthogonal to my post.
As a matter of principle, I feel it is bad for FOSS projects to redirect their users to commercial organizations which so prominently and intentionally advance malevolent business practices. I am requesting this FOSS project cease doing so.
That not a single dissension to my post so far has even attempted to deny the existence of these practices is telling.
In reply to The problem is not that the … by Jeremiah Griffin
Well, musescore.com pays for musescore.org. So don't bite the hand that feeds you
In reply to The problem is not that the … by Jeremiah Griffin
The problem is that no one here at .org has any control over anything. You are complaining in the wrong place.
Did you read the rather extensive terms of use for .com? It is a long and winding road. Not unlike most other terms of use. One could say most of them are deceptive in some way.
I am sorry you missed the point of my post.
What brought you to MuseScore? The app or the sheet music? Personally, I have no use for .com. I have a few scores there that I posted because I was on a forum there. I am no longer involved with them and just haven't gotten around to removing them.
Your complaints are noted. But as has already been pointed out (at least twice) no one here can do anything about it. This an area for users of the app. That's it. Please direct you comments to someplace were they might do some good.
In reply to The problem is that no one… by bobjp
1) It was in fact not once before this message indicated to me that the .org site is not maintained by the .org people. I was first directed to https://musescore.org/en/node/277874, which presently makes no mention of this fact. It says much about billing concerns for the .com domain being directed to the appropriate email, where to request a refund, and where to submit bug reports for the .com website. In fact, the only mention of a place to discuss support on musescore.org on a page titled "where to discuss support for musescore.org or musescore.com" is this forum.
I was then told "Free trials and payments don't exist here on musescore.org, only over on musescore.com" which, again, I never made any requests regarding free trials and payments. Considering my then uncontested belief that the .org site would be maintained by the .org people, a complaint on the .org site constrained solely to the behavior of UI elements on the .org site would be wholly reasonable.
Don't allege my misunderstanding of your post. I misunderstood nothing. Consider that instead of discussing starfish you had the opportunity to inform me what the support page I read prior to writing my post did not - that the .org site is not maintained by the .org people.
2) On further inspection, the musescore app itself embeds much functionality with the user hostile .com website (account integrations, sharing, etc) just the same, so my criticisms stand for the application as well as the the .org website. This doesn't substantively change my original post, nor where it should have been posted, save for that references to ".org" be replaced with "app".
Aside from that, a PR should probably be filed on github as well which I am disinclined to do.
Good day.
In reply to 1) It was in fact not once… by Jeremiah Griffin
Your initial post, 1st sentence:
"Free" trials which cost 60 dollars, nonsensical,
So you very clearly and prominently did mention that
In reply to 1) It was in fact not once… by Jeremiah Griffin
OK. So you stated your case in your first post. And continue to restate it. We get it. You always have to have the last word. We are the .org people. We have to refer people to the .com site when they ask about problems that arise from that site. No one here can answer billing questions.
You didn't answer my last question. So here is an opportunity to ignore another. Within two hours of creating a MuseScore account, Your very first post is a string of accusations (some legitimate), and a final demand to stop sending people to the .com site. Why did you post here? The .org site is for help using the app. Period. The node you referred to states as much. I'm just trying to string together the events that lead to your first post.
Anyway, you have known for hours that your problem is with the .com site. If you believe that they are using unfair tactics, posting here won't help. You can demand things all you want, but doing so here won't mean anything.
It almost seems like the only reason you are here is because someone you know has a problem with .com and you are here to complain about it.
I understand your annoyance but it appears that the musescore.org website is maintained by MuseGroup, the commercial arm of MuseScore and also the group running musescore.com, so there is probably nothing that the forum contributors here on .org can do to about the issue.
As indicated by other members, your complaint really does need to go to .com.