Ukuleles and Musescore 2.0: bug and feature request
INTRO
Latest git version of Musescore (2.0, dated: 12-28-2013) has some wrong issues for ukuleles. The main problem is a clear distinction between scores and playback.
BUGS AND WRONG ISSUES
1. short name on score part for Ukuleles
Actually is "Uk." but it's a diffused convention call it "Uke". For more info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukulele
2. strange refs in instruments list
Ukes has different sizes, the smaller is the sopranino and the bigger is baritone.
The historical size is soprano, but the market rewarded the concert size.
Tenor size is usually confortable and prefered for picking.
All ukes have 4 strings.
How are they tuned usually?
CGEA for ukulele (sopranino, soprano, concert, tenor)
DGBE for baritone ukulele
Bug
The instruments list show:
1. Ukulele
2. Ukulele >>> it mean "Ukulele [tab]", but has a wrong description <<<
3. Tenor Ukulele
4. Baritone Ukulele
There is a wrong description for uke with tab, a ref for "tenor" (only there for playback and a different pitch), an useless ref for baritone (only for playback).
The instrument list should show you this item:
1. Ukulele
FEATURE REQUEST
After you select the instrument for a part/score, could be useful - with forward steps/masks - add configurations per-instrument. Could be useful too change configurations ex-post.
In this case:
Score issues
a) type of score [traditional;tablature for 4 strings]
b) the size [sopranino;soprano;concert;tenor] (infos to add on the score);
c) tune [CGEA; DGBE] (infos to add on the score).
Playback issues
d) the available pitch/instrument for playback.
adding these infos in score as a sub-label for instrument name or somewhere else. This mask will be per-instrument. For example, a drumset could offer a sub-sequent mask to select the right profile (take a look at http://musescore.org/en/node/24074).
Just to make a clear distinction between score editing AND playback.
| Attachment | Size |
|---|---|
| uke.png | 12.7 KB |
Comments
I'm understanding some of this, but not all.
What I do understand:
- You are requesting the default "instrument short name" for ukulele be changed from "Uk" to "Uke". I rather doubt there is much standardization here, and I assume you are aware you can customize this to be whatever you want via Staff Properties, but if there seems to be a consensus that "Uke" is preferable in scores, then by all means, we should do this.
- You are requesting the "part name" shown for the ukulele tablature instrument be changed from "Ukulele" to "Ukulele [tablature]" as is done for other similar cases. This seems a no-brainer, and should definitely be done.
- There is a "sopranino ukulele" missing from the instrument list.
- Although I don't think you pointed this out exactly, the Baritone Ukulele seems to be missing string data, and therefore it is impossible to create a tablature staff for it. And neither Tenor nor Baritone ukes have tablature options in the intruments list.
But I don't understand your feature request at all. Are you perhaps not aware that you can already edit most attributes of an instrument in your score via Staff Properties? Are you asking for something that cannot already be done via that dialog? Or are you saying some of the default settings in that dialog are wrong?
In reply to I'm understanding some of by Marc Sabatella
Thank you Marc for these questions. Like the usability problems shown, it's not an exceding set of details that make things clear. I'll try to explain with other words.
In a stable release, these are bug tickets. Since Musescore 2.0 is a development release not (already) officially relesead, I tried to explain what is wrong, with a general solution (or feature request) useful for many cases. I don't know what is the release timeline or the complexity of the features requested, but bugs are there.
So, answering to your questions...
1) "Uk." is not good, "Uke" is a convention for a short name. From the wikipedia page, first paragraph:
"The ukulele (/ˌjuːkəˈleɪliː/, yoo-ka-lay-lee, from Hawaiian: ʻukulele [ˈʔukuˈlɛlɛ], oo-koo-le-le; British English: ukelele) sometimes abbreviated to uke, is a member of the guitar family of instruments; it generally employs four nylon or gut strings or four courses of strings."
Yes, it could be changed ex-post on score part, but it better to put it at first stage. It's an easy change.
2) Please, re-read my post/page, because this is a double bug. In a stable release the first bug is for the shown label, the "ukulele" item without "[tablature]". In a development release things change. Since that instruments list need only an item ("ukulele"), the size, the tune and the part type are attributes of that "object". The sopranino is a 4-string uke (attribute: size), tuned GCEA (attribute: tune)... but it's an "ukulele". The same for Baritone, it's an "ukulele" with different attributes. Attributes that are informative labels on a score, attributes that could change the playback. And every "object" could need a per-instrument tool to set attributes or editing.
from the last part of your comment...
"But I don't understand your feature request at all. Are you perhaps not aware that you can already edit most attributes of an instrument in your score via Staff Properties? Are you asking for something that cannot already be done via that dialog? Or are you saying some of the default settings in that dialog are wrong?"
My feature request ask for an intuitive way to do things. You have the technical knowledge on "how" the backend works. I'm trying to be productive with this (amazing) editor, quickly. In this case, the lack of usability is described by short time, reduced complexity, tools that don't need a manual. And last but not least, clear distinction between score editing and playback.
HTH
In reply to Thank you Marc for these by dm474
Bug reports against the stable release (1.3) are pointless, as development for that has been stopped, all development effort goes into the upcoming 2.0.
So (only) bugs that (still) exists in the latest nightly build and haven't yet been reported, should get reported via the issue tracker.
Possibly after having been discussed in the technology preview forum.
"Uk." is an abbreviated name (hence the dot), "Uke" a short or nick name.
In reply to Thank you Marc for these by dm474
As Jojo mentions, Uke might be a common slang term, but that really has nothing to do with what is appropriate to use as an abbreivated name in as score. No one calls a flute a "Fl.", but that is indeed the practically universally used abbreviation in scores. A common nickname for a trombone is "bone", but the practically universally used abbreviation in scores is "Tbn." So the question isn't whether people happe to refert to ukulele as ukes; it is whether that is actually the abbreviation commonly used in scores. The problem being, it isn't an instrument commonly used in scores, so it's hard to get data on this.
Also as Jojo mentions, 1.3 is not receiving further fixes, so it's not very relevant to discuss how 1.3 does something, unless maybe it is to poont that 1.3 got something right that is now broke. I think I correctly summarize the list of bugs you mentioned with regard to 2.0, and also listed a couple more of my own. Did i miss something with respect to 2.0?
As for your feature request, again, i'm all for usability, but i just don't understand what you are asking. Currently, you can select from the most popular types of ukulele in a single click. I don't see how it is possible to improve on that from a usability perspective, except to add the missing types I already mentioned tenor and baritone tablature, also both standard and tablature variants for sopranino). Each of these items would already define all relevant playback and display attributes for each of these instruments - no need for users to ever mess with a dialog to tell MuseScore something it already knows. The only time anyone would ever need a dialog is if you decided to invent your own ukulele, or if you decided to have a non-standard tuning for your ukulele and wanted to write for it using tablature. In that case, you'd use the Staff properties dialog to customize the properties of that staff. How is this a usability problem?
In reply to As Jojo mentions, Uke might by Marc Sabatella
Yes, you don't understand what I'm asking for. And it's not only about staff. Please, re-read my post and comment to your questions.
In reply to Yes, you don't understand by dm474
I'm sorry, but I've read your posts here and comments on IRC several times and I still just don't understand. exactly what you are asking for So let me try again to ask you *specific* questions:
Currently, you can add a staff in standard notation for ukulele by simply clicking "Ukulele" (or "Tenor Ukulele", or "Baritone Ukulele") in the "Create New Score" or "Add Instruments" dialog boxes and then pressing "Add" (or double clicking "Tenor ukulele"). MuseScore automatically sets the playback sound, staff names, usable range, and string data for you with absolutely no additional dialogs of any kind required.
Are you claiming there is a usability issue with this? If so, what do you propose as an alternative? Can you post a drawing of a dialog you think would be simpler to use than clicking Tenor Ukulele and pressing Add?
If on the other hand you are claiming the usability is with adding *tablature* staves for ukuleles, we have already acknowledged that listings for "Tenor Ukulele [tablature]" and "Baritone Ukulele [tablature]" should be added. Are you saying that would not be sufficient? If so, what *specifically* do you think would be easier for a user than clicking "Tenor Ukulele [tablature]" then pressing "Add"? Again, can you post a picture of the dialog you think would be easier to use?
Or are you *only* talking people who might for some reason need to change the defaults, such as for non-standard tuning? Right now, this requires going to Staff Properties after score creation. Adding a button to the Create New Score wizard to bring up that same dialog is not a bad idea. Is that all you are asking for?
I am not trying to be difficult. I am trying to understand.
BTW, ironically, I am listening to my wife teach ukulele lessons as I write this :-)
In reply to Yes, you don't understand by dm474
Hmmm... I don't understand precisely what is begin asked for too.
Let us get rid of the 'easy' points first.
1) Missing " (tablature)" in the name of the second ukulele: this has to be fixed. The word IS in the programme data (file
instruments.xml). I think I understand why it does not shows up and I'll post a fix, if I am correct.2) Baritone Ukulele: its current definition lacks the tuning data. The OP said the Baritone Ukulele is tuned D G B E; this is useful, but octave specification is also needed. From other Baritone Ukulele data in
instruments.xml, I gather it is tuned one seventh below the 'normal' ('concert'?) ukulele, the lowest string being d3 (MIDI pitch 50). Is this correct? If yes, then this missing piece of info can be easily added to the programme data. If not, please provide more correct data.3) Are sopranino, soprano, concert and tenor ukulele's all tuned in the same way? Then, which is the difference between them? Are they really different instruments?
Then the less easy point:
4) I fail to understand how an additional step during the creation of each instrument would help usability. The general approach in this area has been to provide ready-made combinations of instrument data / staff properties for the most used cases and give all the customization tools for the less common cases.
Please note that converting the provided "Tenor ukulele" to use a tablature staff (a combination currently not provided) requires only 1 click: after adding the instrument, drop its "Staff type" drop list and select "Tab. ukulele"; to be convinced that another setup could be quicker and easier than that, I need rather strong evidence...
The current (2.0) setup for instrument creation and modification is the result of a rather long process, with several steps and several false starts, driven by user suggestions and criticisms as well as by the developer experience. For instance, a 3-level instrument list, with instrument variations grouped under a main entry for the 'generic' instrument (which has some correspondence with this proposal, if I understand it correctly), has been proposed, discussed and finally discarded, as more cumbersome than the current setup.
More suggestions, like this, may well help to further improve it. The strong points of this proposal are not evident, though, neither to me (for what it worth) or, apparently, to other fellow users. So, I cannot but join Marc Sabatella in asking more details to understand it better.
Thanks,
M.
In reply to Hmmm... I don't understand by Miwarre
I believe soprano, concert, and tenor ukes are indeed normally tuned to the exact same pitches. The difference is just one of size and hence playability as well as tone quality. Kind of like a student model versus full size violin, I suppose. Tenors are just big enough that some (maybe most?) people tune the first G string an octave lower than how it is tuned on others. So, G3 C4 E4 E4 rather than G4 C4 E4 A4. Of course, you can tune any uke owever you like, but I'm talking about what is common/standard. Sopranino is a new one to me.
In reply to I believe soprano, concert, by Marc Sabatella
So, if I am not mistaken, the difference between soprano, concert and one tuning of the tenor, as far as MuseScore is concerned, is only the staff label: same tuning means same staff properties and, as there is only one GM ukulele program, sound is in any case the same.
So, from my utterly ukulele-ignorant perspective, I would think that at most three instrument definitions are required: "ukulele" (appliable to soprano, concert and tenor with high G), "tenor ukulele" (with low G) and "baritone ukulele"; which is more or less the current situation (except for the tuning of the tenor).
Plus the tablature variants deemed important enough to appear in the instrument list and with the suspended 4th ;) of the sopranino.
Am I missing something?
M.
In reply to So, if I am not mistaken, the by Miwarre
Interesting read about Ukulele types http://www.ukuleletricks.com/ukulele-sizes-soprano-concert-tenor-barito…
In reply to So, if I am not mistaken, the by Miwarre
I think you are correct that is really no effective difference as far as MuseScore is concerned between soprano, concert, and tenor ukuleles (with the standard G4 tuning) aside from the staff name. But given these *are* generally recognized as different instruments, I think there's no reason not to continue to maintain separate entries for them. I can't think of any exactly analogous situation elsewhere in instruments.xml, though. Maybe euphonium versus baritone horn, which are technically different instruments but might as well not be.