Slurs and hairpin settings randomly missing between score and parts
So I've recently switched to using MuseScore (over Finale), at the same time I switched to Ubuntu 16.04 LTS. Big change, no regrets! That means that I've started using MuseScore for some pretty demanding work, namely, classical pieces with lots of measures and markings, etc. So far so good--I have been very impressed by all the "features" hidden in MuseScore to make entering music nice and easy.
However, I have one problem that I have noticed on every piece that I've done in MuseScore. I always enter everything from the full score, and then fit everything to the page in the parts before printing. So far so good. The problem is that in every case, random slurs are just completely missing in the parts--visible in the score, but not in the parts. (Fortunately, MuseScore prints what it displays--there doesn't appear to be a problem with the printing. Took me a minute to discover that!) Ditto for hairpin SETTINGS--if I configure a hairpin to be a "text line" in the score, there's a smattering of tiny hairpins in the parts that should be "cresc"s and "dim"s. I've even had a case where I hid several notes in the score--and while the NOTES were hidden in the parts, the stems weren't! I'm not sure what's going on with this, but it is a minor nuisance to print parts up and realize that lots of things are missing!
Attached is a smaller score that I did with MuseScore. Notice the missing slurs on the violin 1 part in measures 5, 7, 9, 11 and every time that phrase appears (but notice the slur present in measure 8). I will note that I arranged that set of measures once, and then copied said measures every other time it repeats--that may be a clue. Interestingly, if I delete a slur from the parts, it disappears from the score too. (And if I add a slur in the parts, it appears in the score.) How in the world then are slurs visible on the score, but NOT the parts?!
Ditto for the hairpins in the score: it had several hairpins, so I just selected them, and changed them to "text lines." They appear correctly on the score, but NONE of the parts changed! Again, if I delete a hairpin from the parts, it also disappears from the score. (However, if I change the hairpin to a "text line" in the PART, it does not change on the score.) This is quite annoying--I like to enter everything in the score, and not have to error-check/re-enter slurs and hairpins on each of the parts.
Suggestions?
| Attachment | Size |
|---|---|
| Gershwin, George - Rialto Ripples Rag (quintet).mscz | 87.49 KB |
Comments
The slurs seem to be a known issue that has been fixed for the next release. #189736: On copy/paste measure(s) with slur(s) in score, the slur(s) get(s) lost in part
As for the hairpin settings. They are mostly part specific. MuseScore does not assume the layout for a part will be the same as the whole score. It is necessary to adjust the hairpins individually in the parts and the score. Perhaps there is a better way of doing this, but there are many variables with a hairpin that would make it difficult to know that they need to be exactly the same in the parts as the score.
Perhaps MuseScore could allow an option to have the score and parts TOTALLY linked. They are currently only partially linked. For example when parts are already extracted: If you change a note in one it will update in the other; if you edit a lines display using ctrl+arrows (dim. pedal...) it will only be changed in the score or part you are working on; if you change the span of the same line using shift+arrows it will be applied to both the part and score; if you enter a line break it will only be applied to the current part or score. These are a few items that show how the scores are currently only PARTIALLY linked. If MuseScore were to allow the total linking of parts, all of the changes in one will be seen in the other. I would expect the default to be the parts are partially linked so the current results are consistent. The trick for the programmers will be managing how switching between the two modes would be handled. The user could have the parts partially linked and adjust both parts and the score, then totally link them, but there are differences between the two.
In reply to The slurs seem to be a known… by mike320
If it came down to it, I'd vote to having everything be FULLY linked between the scores and parts; yes, some people really want to make a neat conductor's score, but I think it's more valuable for the musicians to have readable parts--without musicians, a conductor is just a person waving their hands in the air!
Finale handles it this way: everything is linked, until you move an object on the parts, then it goes "orange" and is unlinked (you can right-click objects and click "Re-link to score").
I'd just like it so that if something's visible on the score, it's visible on the parts the same way.
In reply to If it came down to it, I'd… by FullSound
Having the score and parts fully linked all the time would be a bad idea, because the conductor needs to be able to read his score as well as the musicians.
Since I haven't used any notation software but MuseScore I don't know how others handle this, beside what you just told me about Finale.
I believe part of the problem with implementing this in MuseScore is the way they handle offsets from the defaults. The offsets are simply spaces, which is the distance from line to line in a staff - this is a fixed distance. To allow the parts and scores to be totally linked, they would need to rethink the offset and use a relative distance. If you shrink the hairpin it would change from a size of 1 to something like a size of .865 (86.5%) of the default size or 1.23 (123%) of the default size. This would allow total linking of parts and scores so shrinking a hairpin in a score with 4 measures in it doesn't make the part with 8 measures on the same line have a dot for the crescendo.
My suggestion may not be THE answer, but it is an answer that would not mean totally rewriting the current method of programming the score.
In reply to Having the score and parts… by mike320
You have a point there--with all of my thousands of measures of arrangements, I all but never use the conductor's score, so it really only matters to me for note input! There's other people on the planet ;-).
In reply to You have a point there--with… by FullSound
If you don't use the conductors score, then use it just to enter the notes and then don't worry about any affect editing the parts has on the score. As I said, the slur issue will be fixed in the next release.
My idea would also allow for a feature that has often been requested by users to be able to make all of the parts and scores have the same number of measures on a line and systems on a page. They can then deal with the results if they don't like the way it looks.
In reply to If you don't use the… by mike320
Thanks. How about the hairpin issue? I don't want to have to edit every single hairpin in all of the parts to get them to print as "cresc" and "dim".
In reply to Thanks. How about the… by FullSound
You need to use the advanced workspace and enter them as cresc. and dim. to begin with. See https://musescore.org/en/handbook/palettes-and-workspaces#workspaces
I didn't understand what you were talking about either.
In reply to You need to use the advanced… by mike320
I've been in the Advanced workspace, but just found it easier to enter hairpins with the "<" and ">" keys. Just gave that a try, and found that the "cresc" and "dim" in the palette are merely shortcuts to hairpins with "text line" automatically selected upon entry. (Plus changing the line to "dotted" instead of "solid.") Uncheck "text line", and it goes to a regular hairpin on the score. The difficulty is that the "text line" option is not connected across score and parts. It only works from the palette because the hairpin is ENTERED with "text line" checked. Guess what: if I uncheck "text line" on a "cresc" entered from the palette, it doesn't go back to a hairpin in the parts.
In reply to I've been in the Advanced… by FullSound
If you want edits on the score to show up in the parts, you need to do the editing before creating pars. You can select all of the cresc. and dim. you entered with < and > and edit them at the same time. Right click one and chose Select>All similar items. Make your adjustments in the inspector then create parts and they will be as you want them. This is one of the things that sort of linked to the parts. You will need to play with MuseScore a bit to see what can be edited in the score and will show up in the parts. I tested all of this in a few seconds to ensure I'm giving you good info for 2.1. For example, I created a two part score, and checked how the hairpins work.
I'm French so , my English...... I re-create a part for VIOLIN 1, I name it V1, and all the slurs of your score are in V1.
I don't understand when you say "you configurate the harpin to be a text line", How do you do that
In reply to I'm French so , my English… by Raymond Wicquart
Click on the hairpin, and then in the "Inspector", click the checkbox that says, "Text Line" (circled)
![Untitled.png]( "Untitled.png")
In reply to Click on the hairpin, and… by FullSound
Thanks, i am in musescore 2.03 in french version, I have only the first 1/3 of this "inspector".
Have you try to re-create your part of Violin 1 ?
In reply to Thanks, i am in musescore 2… by Raymond Wicquart
Upgrade to 2.1 then.